Price stability: A good or a bad thing?

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3,371
6,241
Hawkes Bay
Experience
Commercial
I don't expect price stability. I expect the complete opposite. Prices go up and prices go down. I am a beekeeper and am not really interested in marketing but I find it interesting that every article I read or see on honey is Ra Ra Things are fantastic, sales have never been better et cetera but when you talk to beekeepers it's a whole different story.I may be wrong but from what I've seen and heard I get the distinct impression that the demand for manuka is down and that markets are saturated. When something is oversupplied and overvalued it invariably leads to a price correction. I don't think manuka will go back to being worth 3p a pound and I'm damn sure that table manuka is not worth $2000 a pot no matter how flash a label it has. The true value of manuka obviously lies somewhere between these two price points and in the end the market will decide what that price is .
I accept that I tend to be a bit negative when it comes to what has happened with manuka but there are plenty out there swimming madly upstream to balance out anything I say.
 
50
29
Katikati
Experience
Commercial
Is Mono a good thing? I think multi with lots of variety superior. All that bush and pasture loaded with lots of goodies
It's all mono in Canada. One alfalfa/canola source. Processed to death to stay runny.
I agree with Frazz, my $4 must be a great deal. It's not Manuka..
 
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5,526
5,846
canterbury
Experience
Commercial
We been busy extracting Multi today ..... a real tasty honey dew /clover mix .
Five years ago it was worth $14/kg . Today it is probably value less.
In the present climate we should have taken the bees away and got them to produce a mono somthing, but in the early summer they looked like garbage and I could'nt be bothered to. move them.

What to do with four tonne ..... stick it in the brew pot ..... give it away to ensure site access next year .....

Yeah nah stupid ..... persuade people in the Big Smoke to put it on toast and eat it for breakie.
 
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245
156
Christchurch
Experience
Beginner
Phew .... I just had to sit down for a coffee .....another one after my mate emailed me from Canada ..... reporting that some of his mates are selling Canada No 1 for $7.14NZD/kg.

Gravy train must be about to roll into town @frazzledfozzle
At the supermarket honey is around $10 per 500g or $20 per kg. If producers get $4 where is the mark up from?
We sold community honey at $8 per 500g but we also spun and bottled it. Small market, one day only sale as per law. But we still got $16 per kg. And that was community discounted.
 
245
156
Christchurch
Experience
Beginner
Commerce 101

You buy from the primary industry, pack it and add 50%
You wholesale it, add 50%
You retail it, add 30-40%

How do you think people make money in business?
You buy from the primary industry, pack it and add 50% $4.00 to $6.00
You wholesale it, add 50% $6.00 to $9.00
You retail it, add 30-40% $9.00 to $12.60

There is a large discrepancy between $12.60 to $20 and that's with me compounding the mark ups.

The point I was leaning towards is there is someone making a fairly large markup and its not the producers. The packers and producers should find a way to drop out the middle layers. If Packers and producers worked together they could triple their income.

Its a typical pyramid profit scheme where the people sitting on their rear ends get paid a fortune for doing very little while the sucker sweating their donkey off gets broker and broker over time.

Viva la revolution I say.
 
62
47
New Zealand
Experience
International
You buy from the primary industry, pack it and add 50% $4.00 to $6.00
You wholesale it, add 50% $6.00 to $9.00
You retail it, add 30-40% $9.00 to $12.60

There is a large discrepancy between $12.60 to $20 and that's with me compounding the mark ups.

The point I was leaning towards is there is someone making a fairly large markup and its not the producers. The packers and producers should find a way to drop out the middle layers. If Packers and producers worked together they could triple their income.

Its a typical pyramid profit scheme where the people sitting on their rear ends get paid a fortune for doing very little while the sucker sweating their donkey off gets broker and broker over time.

Viva la revolution I say.
50% $4.00 - $6.00 do we conveniently forget, packing materials, testing, freight, labour etc. Any packer buying a kg for $4 and selling packed for $6 has already lost money.
The product may be sold to a distributor before getting to retail - Another layer. Necessary though if you want smaller retailers to also have access.
Each layer has freight, labour, marketing etc
Internationally you add duties and different compliance costs. Your commerce 101 probably needs a revision.
 
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5,526
5,846
canterbury
Experience
Commercial
You buy from the primary industry, pack it and add 50% $4.00 to $6.00
You wholesale it, add 50% $6.00 to $9.00
You retail it, add 30-40% $9.00 to $12.60

There is a large discrepancy between $12.60 to $20 and that's with me compounding the mark ups.

The point I was leaning towards is there is someone making a fairly large markup and its not the producers. The packers and producers should find a way to drop out the middle layers. If Packers and producers worked together they could triple their income.

Its a typical pyramid profit scheme where the people sitting on their rear ends get paid a fortune for doing very little while the sucker sweating their donkey off gets broker and broker over time.

Viva la revolution I say.
Amen to that ..... I can sharpen yer hive tool if you need me to.
 
245
156
Christchurch
Experience
Beginner
50% $4.00 - $6.00 do we conveniently forget, packing materials, testing, freight, labour etc. Any packer buying a kg for $4 and selling packed for $6 has already lost money.
The product may be sold to a distributor before getting to retail - Another layer. Necessary though if you want smaller retailers to also have access.
Each layer has freight, labour, marketing etc
Internationally you add duties and different compliance costs. Your commerce 101 probably needs a revision.
Which is why I am asking where the money is being made / cost added. If there is a supply chain of multiple steps between producer and consumer - is it possible to remove some of the chain.

In my experience there is often some corporate or clever clogs in the middle who takes a clip with no added value. I went to get a product the other day, and noted 3 hands it had gone through to get to my client. They could have gotten it themselves and cut out two wholesalers. Drop shipping is a classic example of this.

What stops someone with a few web skills and a bit of nouce setting up a supply that looks like: BeeKeeper ->Packer -> Website ->Purchaser. Drop ship from the packer or if the Beek is really clever they drop off product to the packer, collect it packed and ship it themselves.

At present there is a 500% mark up from Beek to Supermarket if $4 to $20 per kg is used as a figure. It seems criminal that the closer to primary producer you are the more work you do and the less return is made.
 
5,526
5,846
canterbury
Experience
Commercial
Ask a marketer Wknz ..... perhaps they don't put $4.00/kg in as a starting point .
Maybe it's higher.
Maybe SSP knows something ..... where'd he come from anyway ..... whizz kid from the retail sector got a couple of beehives in his/her back garden and looking at cranking the trade and saving us all from slavery ......
Prhaps SSP could teach us something .....
Masters class in 101 marketing ?
 

Grant

Staff member
Founder Member
Platinum
10,258
4,792
Which is why I am asking where the money is being made / cost added. If there is a supply chain of multiple steps between producer and consumer - is it possible to remove some of the chain.

In my experience there is often some corporate or clever clogs in the middle who takes a clip with no added value. I went to get a product the other day, and noted 3 hands it had gone through to get to my client. They could have gotten it themselves and cut out two wholesalers. Drop shipping is a classic example of this.

What stops someone with a few web skills and a bit of nouce setting up a supply that looks like: BeeKeeper ->Packer -> Website ->Purchaser. Drop ship from the packer or if the Beek is really clever they drop off product to the packer, collect it packed and ship it themselves.

At present there is a 500% mark up from Beek to Supermarket if $4 to $20 per kg is used as a figure. It seems criminal that the closer to primary producer you are the more work you do and the less return is made.

It's already done and been discussed many times. Which is why we have the produce finder to allow public to get to the source directly - their local beekeeper, who could stick something in a jar make it look pretty and charge $15 per 500g jar. The produce section is empty.

Likewise the marketplace for industry sales - I have 500kg of clover for sale at xx dollars - empty.
You have a guy on the forum wanting to buy honey-dew to make some meade and so far the only reaction has been, what a waste of honey-dew. I mean :unsure:
 
62
47
New Zealand
Experience
International
Which is why I am asking where the money is being made / cost added. If there is a supply chain of multiple steps between producer and consumer - is it possible to remove some of the chain.

In my experience there is often some corporate or clever clogs in the middle who takes a clip with no added value. I went to get a product the other day, and noted 3 hands it had gone through to get to my client. They could have gotten it themselves and cut out two wholesalers. Drop shipping is a classic example of this.

What stops someone with a few web skills and a bit of nouce setting up a supply that looks like: BeeKeeper ->Packer -> Website ->Purchaser. Drop ship from the packer or if the Beek is really clever they drop off product to the packer, collect it packed and ship it themselves.

At present there is a 500% mark up from Beek to Supermarket if $4 to $20 per kg is used as a figure. It seems criminal that the closer to primary producer you are the more work you do and the less return is made.
If the raw material cost is $4 and the finished product is $20 it is still not a 500% markup. You need to remove the GST from the $20
$20 - GST = $17.39
$17.39 - Retailer margin 33% = $11.47
If it is a 500g jar
$11.47 - 2 x Jar, 2 x lid, 2 x label = Approx $9.47
$9.47 - starting cost of $4.00 = $5.47
$5.47 - Freight from Beekeeper to packer then packer to retailer say $0.50 each trip = $4.47
$4.47 - Testing, process cost, compliance, overhead, labour etc etc say $1.50 per kg
$2.97 per kg left and this is without a distributor and without allowing the promotional support expected by the retailer.
 


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