Apitraz problem?

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anyone had problems with Apitraz ?
boss got the cheap version of Apivar but 6 weeks into the treatment hives have very high mite loads (jar tested).
it looks to be fairly widespread and is in some of the remote hives that don't have neighbours in range. so reinvasion is unlikely and resistance highly doubtful.
 

Alastair

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Seen a different problem with it. Was contacted this spring by a beekeeper who was caring for around 45 hives at a site, plus had (from memory) maybe a dozen hives of their own at the same site plus maybe a dozen at another site. The 45 other hives were at this point not treated yet, and the other hives had Apitraz. The hives with Apitraz had had it for around 2 weeks.

All the hives with Apitraz the bees were listless and just sitting there like they were cold or something, and the hives were going backwards in number, at a time when they should have been building up. The beekeeper wanting to make splits but it was looking like the hives may fade away and die completely. None of the hives with no treatment had the problem.

The only difference I could see was that some hives had Apitraz and some did not. So we pulled the Apitraz and replaced with Apivar. In a couple of weeks those bees were looking normal and hives beginning to recover.

Of course this is not a scientific double blind study, it's just anecdotal.

Some time ago I heard talk from some commercials about Apitraz not working for them, end of treatment bees still had mites. For whatever reason and I am not sure what the reasoning was, they thought the strips were releasing the amitraz very quickly and giving a very strong dose for 3 weeks, then not enough. Allowing some mites to survive. If that was the case, then a very strong early release of amitraz might explain the problem with the hives I looked at this spring.

Of course we don't know what goes on in a boardroom and behind closed doors. But if an early release of too much amitraz had been detected from the strips, something may have been done to counter that, and had the opposite effect and hence you still got mite problems. Of course that too, is pure conjecture on my part, I got no idea what the manufacturers do and such unscientific opinion should be no reflection on the product. But as you asked, I'm just sharing my thoughts and observations.
 
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Rob Atkinson

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Used it in the spring , not overly happy with the results.
Won't be using again
Too many random hives with mites at end of treatment .
Ran Oxalic strips over summer to hold them and that seemed to have worked.
Using Apivar and Oxalic this autumn with formic on any hives with PMS or DWV
As bayvarol is no longer a option (apistan
Probably not either)
 
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sounds like there is enough issues to warrant avoiding it.
was debating things like storage conditions, but thats all been fine on our end. however doesn't mean its been good during transport (eg at airport or docks). if i read it right they have an upper temp limit for storage. i would guess that they start dispersing at high (brood nest) temps. amitraz has a vapor part to it. especially as this brand is not vacuum packed. ie if stored at high temps it may have dispersed inside the packet. that would certainly cause poor mite treatment.

well boss is up for cost of retreat $$$ and dealing with pms hives is no fun.
 
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Alastair

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Not vacuum packed is a risk indeed, since amitraz is broken down by oxygen, and the 1/2 life is only a few days.
 
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Not vacuum packed is a risk indeed, since amitraz is broken down by oxygen, and the 1/2 life is only a few days.

Not sure about this, it would make apivar a useless treatment as it is exposed to oxygen in the hive as well; certainly no purpose, if this is true, having it in for 10 weeks. Maybe advisable to be a bit careful with statements like this, as it is a public statement you make.
 

Alastair

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Sorry, but my statement is quite correct, I am not a reckless fool who talks crap. ( Well not all the time anyway :LOL: ). A little research before you spoke could have enlightened you, but anyhow it's probably a good thing you mentioned it cos not everyone will do the research.

So to explain, in apivar the amitraz (the active ingredient) is within a plastic strip where it is protected, and once in a hive slowly leaches out over several months. It only breaks down at any speed once out of the strip and exposed to oxygen. This breaking down once out of the strip takes several days, so the manufacturers have designed things so there is a steady stream of amitraz leaching out of the strips, enough so that even as it slowly degrades, there is sufficient level in the hive to deal with the mites.

As an aside, people sometimes complain about the price of apivar. I don't know what their profits are, but I do know that a heckuva lot of research went into the development of the strips before they were on sale commercially. It was not just a case of mixing in some chemical with some plastic. It had to be carefully formulated and many trials done before they got the right balance that would leach just the right amount into a hive in just the right time period to do the optimum job on the mites.
 
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small update.
word on the grapevine is there is a known issue with them.
whats interesting is the lads report that the strips they are pulling out have no wax or propolis on them like other strips do. its like the bees are not touching them. that certainly would account for them not working.
 
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I used apitraz once few yrs ago and while it did seem ok I also found this graph on hiveworld and it did make me question its efficiency. Think this graph mayb from April 2020? Just type in apitraz vs apivar in internet and u should find the whole thing. Being that I know people using it this year .. so far they are happy with it but the years not out yet so best to wait and see b4 verdict out
 

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Alastair

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It's so small I can't read it properly but does that pie chart say that after Apitraz treatment the hives still had 40% of the mites?
 
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It's so small I can't read it properly but does that pie chart say that after Apitraz treatment the hives still had 40% of the mites?
i found the original on thorpe uk site. its from apivar faq pdf.
the red in the graph is how many hives had above 50 mites left over in the hive after treatment. however they only have 15 hives treated with apitraz compared to 159 with apivar.
so the graph shows apitraz had 6 hives out of 15 that had over 50 mites left after treatment.
 
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i forgot to update.
boss checked one of the yard hives the other day which has had apitraz in it for the last +2 months, 11/300 mites to bees. i say something very wrong with those strips.
incidentally that hive was the control when i did the OAE as it only had 1/300 mid season.
i will go through the hives a bit more once it stops raining as its neighbouring hives had OAE and it will be good to see their levels and OAE side effects.
 


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